Where is the "line"?

[Folly1]

Barry showed me a better line at Barber and this helped a lot.

My question is in the title. I know that often it involves using the entire track if you are fast enough. But not always. I just watched a video of Toseland at Barber. He was not entering T1 from the left, but rather from the middle of the track. Why is this turn not started more from the outside?

Is there a general rule for finding the line if there is no one to show you?

Is there a single line that is the fastest route around any particular track for a given weight of bike and rider? I have been shown different lines by different CR's on the same track? Why does this variation exist?

Why are the 125s and 250s less "line" dependent? You can see this even in MotoGp where they are all over the track.

I think K. Code says the best line is the one that lets you get on the throttle soonest. Do you agree with this?

I would appreciate anyother thoughts on this topic.


Ben.

[JVance]

Some times it is a personal preference. If you race you will tend to not go out as wide to protect the inside line. Sometimes it is how you are trying to set up for the next turn. The lighter the bikes, like the 125's/250's can carve a tighter line because they are so much lighter. It is a good idea to be able to take different lines so you can set up passing and not get freaked out if you screw up. There is no ONE best line around any track. It depends on many factors. Normally the best line is not the same one the guy in front of you is taking so you can set up a pass or avoid a collision if he screws up or checks up.

John
#607 A

[barry38]

I pretty much agree with what John said. In general an outside-inside-outside line is the logical choice. However, a single turn does not exist in a vaccum. Many times turn entry is dictated but when you want to be at turn exit to set up for the next turn.

Here are a couple of examples of lines I use at various tracks:

Turn 1 - 2 at Barber: Approaching Turn 1 I'm within 1-2 feet of the right side of the track. I initiate the turn at my turn in point, apex with tire tracks within 1 foot of the inside edge of the track. As I drive off the apex I want to be 6-8 feet from the right side of the track. I enter Turn 2 on this line. Basically, as I complete Turn 1, I pick the bike up and initiate the turn in for Turn 2.

Barber is a unique track in my opinion as every corner is a combination of corners which creates a situation that you really have to concentrate on where you exit a given corner to properly enter the next one. A bad entry to one corner can kill you through the next 2 to 4 corners there.

VIR Turn 2-3: I exit Turn 2 on the left 2/3 of the track. I set up for the left kink before Turn 3 at mid track, take the kink tight to the left edge of the track and allow the bike to drift out to the right edge of the track as I approach Turn 3. At speed I'm am constantly turning from the kink to the exit of Turn 3. Again, you want to be within a foot of the left edge of the track at the apex of Turn 3. I trail brake from turn-in to the apex of 3. At the apex, I'm on the gas and drive hard off the corner, I finish the turn within a foot of the right edge of the track. If I'm on line and at speed I feel a small bump just as the bike is straight up and down.

Summit Point Turn 4-5: You want to be on the far left side of the track as you approach turn in for Turn 4. At turn in you should be on the gas, accelerating slightly to the apex, which is within a foot of the right edge of the track. I feed in gas as I come off the apex letting the bike come to about mid track. At that point I stand the bike up, downshift 3 gears and am hard on the brakes, trailbraking to the apex of Turn 5. I prefer to enter Turn 5 on a fairly tight line. This allows me to get the direction change done and be a max lean for the shortest period of time. I exit Turn 5 within 5 feet of the left side of the track. This gives me a direct (straight line) into Turn 6. This is a situation where you give up a little time getting through 5, but puts you on the preferred line going into 6, which is is where you can make time on this track.

You have to remember that none of this is written in stone when it comes to lines. Different circumstances will dictate you make adjustments to you given line. Don't be afraid to experiment with different lines just to see what the results might be. And don't hesitate to grab someone in an orange shirt to help you out if you need it!

[JVance]

Another example;

VIR South--Coming through the kink and going down hill to the corner just before the oak tree. I like the line where you come through the kink and stay on the right side of the track and break all the way to the apex of the corner before the Oak tree. this allows me to keep the bike upright and extend my breaking zone. Basically I ignore that turn. I was told to do this by a CR a couple of years ago and it really works for me. The same day another CR follows me and tell me NOT to do that, to set the same corner up on the left side of the track and make one big arc through both corners...I'll do either depending on if someone is in front of me and where they are on the track. This is a sort of an extreme example of line choice. Both lines will get you through both corners at about the same speed it is just a matter of where and how you will scrub speed for the oak tree.

Just like Barry said about 4-5 at Summit. I do the same thing but if he were in front of me I would set up a little wider for T-5 and hope he got in a little to hot on the inside, if he gets too wide on the exit I would try to get on the gas and get by him before before 6. He has the defenseive line through 5 but if he screws it up I got him. On the other hand If I do that I leave the door open for the guy behind me to squeeze in and I loose a spot...

What a game...I love it!

By the way, I think this is the type of thing the CR's look for in the bumping process...Are you using your head?? Are you thinking out there or just trying to RIDE HARD? I don't know because I am not in the CR loop but my guess is that is close.

John

[Peter Faulkner]

For what its worth, I had a very well respected educator in our community tell me...."when racing the best line is whatever line puts you up front"......inside line, outside line, defensive, offensive, knee up, knee down, elbow up, elbow down, full grip or sliding everywhere.....whatever way helps you finish the race and do so in the front is the best.

[Matt H]

For what its worth, I had a very well respected educator in our community tell me...."when racing the best line is whatever line puts you up front"......inside line, outside line, defensive, offensive, knee up, knee down, elbow up, elbow down, full grip or sliding everywhere.....whatever way helps you finish the race and do so in the front is the best.

Just a note: Solid advice for racing. But "racing" and track days ARE NOT the same.

[Peter Faulkner]

Very true, very true!